Hi all. My current setup is an 18" exo terra with a CHE in one corner on a herpstat controlled to 88 deg. The rest of the enclosure is at an ambient
temp of ~82-83 deg. This works great except I have a hard time keeping the humidity up. The screen is already covered in plexi except for where the CHE is.
Now to my question...Would it be ok to just remove the humidity sucking CHE entirely and keep a constant 24/7 temp of 82-83? Seems like I am having to choose
between a temp gradient and propper humidity.
                        
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No Temp Gradiant?
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 td30.chondroforum |
No Temp Gradiant? |
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Posts: 1 (05/10/08 21:35:23) |
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luckystrike |
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Posts: 57 (05/10/08 21:57:02)
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Do not remove the heatsource! A prolonged exposure to a lower temp and high humidity is the perfect recipe for r/i. I would suggest installing a small radiant
heat panel or just using incandescent light as your heat source. The temp gradient is more important (imo) than the high humidity. In fact, the only time I
substantially increase humidity is when an animal is in a shed cycle.
Nathan Boone ntbwbc@mizzou.edu |
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Shiloh Hawkesworth |
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Posts: 1670 (05/11/08 05:22:18)
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What are you using for substrate? How big is the water bowl?
Shiloh Hawkesworth
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td30.chondroforum |
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Posts: 2 (05/11/08 15:18:31) |
I haven't removed the heat source. Just wanted some opinions about it. Substrate is coconut fiber, water bowl is kinda small.
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MegF42 |
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Posts: 1900 (05/11/08 16:07:54)
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88 is kind of warm for the warm side. Usually temps should be around 85 although I keep mine at 82 and they seem to do better at that temperature. Try using a
heat mat on the wall or top of the exoterra instead of the heat emitter and see if that helps.
5.5~Cornsnakes
3.4.1~Green Tree Pythons 2.1.2~Amazon tree boas 1.0~California Kingsnake Assorted: Horses, dogs, and cats www.Franclycac.com |
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aaron florian |
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Posts: 2689 (05/11/08 18:26:22)
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Get rid of the CHE, and try one of those Desert Ray panels. Let me know how it works, cuz I'm about to invest in them for the exos (maybe).
I have one cage with a CHE, built into my (unfinished) entertainment center, and I hate it. They are like sponges, and that cage is almost completely closed (vent in the back)... with the top, I can only imagine how much it leaks humidity. With the exos, if the top isn't covered pretty much completely, it's tough to keep any humidity in there. Remember, humidty is a relationship between water vapor and pressure for our purposes.... if you have no pressure system in there (i.e. constant air flow) you're fighting a losing battle. Best of luck!
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230 (c)(1) ... it's what's for breakfast |
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td30.chondroforum |
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Posts: 4 (06/03/08 22:05:10) |
Sorry to bring back an old thread, but the noob has a few more questions. After a month of observation, I have been able to keep the heat and humidity
basically where I want them but my GTP always ends up perching in the coolest corner of the enclosure (~82 day / 80 night). The warm corner is about 88. What
info should I be getting from this? Is the enclosure too warm? I am shutting off the hot spot at night which leaves an ambient temp of about 80-81. Should I
offer some hot spot at night as well? It seems most folks here are dropping the temp at night. Is this dependant on the age of the snake, for breeding
purposes, or just because that is closer to what they would see in the wild? I think my little guy is doing well, but I just want to make sure I am doing what
I can to make things comfortable for him. Thanks.
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BuddyBuscemi |
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Posts: 375 (06/04/08 04:26:14)
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Are you measuring your air temps @ 88 degrees or are you measuring a hot spot @ 88 degrees? Yes, there is a difference. I keep my adult enclosures between
86-87 degrees measuring air temps under the heat panels, which gives me a hot spot of 90 degrees. The cool side of the cage measures 78 degrees using air
temps and 80 degrees measuring perch surface temps. I don't believe a night drop will hurt your animal.
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Sony Raju |
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Posts: 1137 (06/04/08 05:22:21)
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i keep all my cages at 85-88 range in the hot spot. since changing up the temperature, ihave noticed that none of the animals get sick, and they seem to have
faster metablism.
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td30.chondroforum |
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Posts: 5 (06/04/08 09:23:15) |
I measure the temps on the perching locations themselves with a temp gun, hot =88, cool=81. I actually just measure the snake itself for the cool temp because that is where he hangs out. Sony, do you drop drop the temp at night? |
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Sony Raju |
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Posts: 1144 (06/04/08 12:57:26)
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my temp gradient is from 82-87ish. no i do not use a night drop except for during breeding season. hope this helps.
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 greg stephens2 |
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Posts: 1066 (06/04/08 13:53:07)
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I can tell you in my opinion that if you choose to keep you animals at 82 to 84 with no oppertunity to bask they will suffer health related problems.
So that said 88 with in IR temp gun is not too hot, I keep my thermostat probes below the RHP's I use at perch heigth and set them for 89 to 90. This provides surface temps directly below the panels between 90 and 98.<<measured with a IRTG>> YES I have animals that use the basking areas and some times for days on end. I have even shot animals at temps between 96 and 108. The trick is to not keep the animals at these temps is not the use these temps through out the entire cage, I keep what I call my back ground temps <air temps> at the upper perches between 85 to 88 depending on the location checked with the warmer reading being closer to the basking spot. During the day I keep the coolest part of the cage between 82 to 85 again depending on the location checked with the warmer reading being closer to the basking spot. Up until several weeks ago I would not have recomended night drops but right now my opinion is a night drop of 6 to 8 degrees through out the year is a healthy thing for your chondros. It is natural and allows their metabolism to relax or rest. Again I think the trick is offering them a spot where they can obtain high body temps during the day so they can use them as they wish to digest meals, self medicate/cook off any health issues as they may arise. Think about you chondros cage a bit more like this, you should be offering the animal the temps it could have access to if it where a tree in Indo. What I mean is if a chondro was to climb up to the top of the canopy and bask in direct sun light it would be able to obtain temps far above 88 degrees. But it could also stay in the shade of the canopy and stay cooler say in the 82 to 88 degree range. Then the sun would set and the animal would experience cooler temps for 8 to 12 hours. The bottom line is in my opinion that we as keepers think we know what our animals need when infact we have no idea. I feel we should offer them ranges that they would see in the wild and let them select the correct temp for them at that time. You can see what your animals are looking for, you just have to watch them. One last thought, keeping chondros on the drier side is a good thing, mine do well in bone dry drained cages with no substrate at all and a moderately sized water bowl. Hope that all makes sense!
Greg Stephens
gstephens_1@clearviewcatv.net I lost JB's watch!!!!! I have big steel pole envy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I was told ,"By the way.........plastic is plastic - I've been in the cancer field for 20+ years now and I've never had a patient get cancer from burning plastic!" I had to ask my self what was this guy thinking!! 
Last Edited By: greg stephens2
06/04/08 14:00:21.
Edited 1 times.
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td30.chondroforum |
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Posts: 6 (06/04/08 15:24:37) |
Thanks Greg. This is pretty much what I have set up. I have just never seen him utilize the basking spot. I will continue to offer it though. So you keep
them very dry huh? What type of climate do you live in? I live in Colorado where it is basically a desert (RH between 20-30%). You have good results with
this humidity?
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greg schroeder |
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Posts: 4579 (06/04/08 15:51:06)
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Side note: Relative humidity % is relative to temperature. The same dew point temperature given two different temperatures will have a different % relative
humidity. Ironically relative humidity % is irrelevant without a known actual temperature.
Dew point temperature is a constant figure much more suitable for expressing how wet the air might be for chondro health. It can be reviewed for many natural locals of the green tree python. You'll find the majority of locals have near complete air saturation by night when the air temperature drops to near or at dew point temperature. By day the air temperature is above dew point temperature often and air is slightly dryer. Also keep in mind the wild snakes likely move closer to wet ground by night and higher in dryer tree canopy by day. http://www.wunderground.com/global/ID.html
WWJD
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greg schroeder |
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Posts: 4580 (06/04/08 16:00:14)
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June 4 2008
Jayupura http://www.wunderground.com/history/station/97690/2008/6/4/DailyHistory.html?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA Biak http://www.wunderground.com/history/station/97560/2008/6/4/DailyHistory.html?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA Wamena http://www.wunderground.com/history/station/97686/2008/6/4/DailyHistory.html?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA
WWJD
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BuddyBuscemi |
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Posts: 377 (06/05/08 02:49:49)
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Thanks Greg!
Are you still using a misting system for your chondros? You said bone dry and I was wondering if you abandoned misting. Greg Stephens lives in the "New Iron Range" aka Maryland. Buddy B |
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greg stephens2 |
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Posts: 1067 (06/05/08 03:11:25)
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LOL, Yes I still used the misting system and drains.
The way I have this set up right now is the system kicks on sprays for about 5min. one to three times a day depending on which cages we are talking about. But the cages are Bone dry in under an hour on most days depending on the room dynamic of my set up, and outside RH%, and DPT's. Here are some shots of what I have set up. 
This last shot is only minus a 3" water bowl, mist nozzle, and snake. Other than that like I said above I use no substrate, and I like a lot of ventilation I also have a ceiling fan, and three other fans that run 24/7 to ensure the animals cages never become stale or stay wet. I did check my RH and DPT at one point and was sort of shock at how high it was considering I work to keep a dryer set up. But I do not worry about where any of those are at on a normal basis,I concern myself with if the animals stay hydrated, have good sheds, and are never in a damp, stale, and stagnant cage. Hope that covers it!
Greg Stephens
gstephens_1@clearviewcatv.net I lost JB's watch!!!!! I have big steel pole envy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I was told ,"By the way.........plastic is plastic - I've been in the cancer field for 20+ years now and I've never had a patient get cancer from burning plastic!" I had to ask my self what was this guy thinking!!
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Larry Stroud |
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Posts: 27 (06/05/08 03:25:46)
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greg stephens2 wrote: I'm just curious Greg, what kind of RHP are you using? I don't see them in the photos. |
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greg stephens2 |
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Posts: 1069 (06/05/08 09:41:26)
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Larry,
The acrylics are heated by 11" flexwatt that is mounted in a false back. If you look closely you can see it's location in the last pic above. This set up makes the rear wall of the cage a RHP or radiant heat emitting surface to be exact. I do use 12" x 12" 50 watt SSHC RHP's in the Neodesha arboreal's I have.
Greg Stephens
gstephens_1@clearviewcatv.net I lost JB's watch!!!!! I have big steel pole envy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I was told ,"By the way.........plastic is plastic - I've been in the cancer field for 20+ years now and I've never had a patient get cancer from burning plastic!" I had to ask my self what was this guy thinking!!
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Only Chondro |
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Posts: 595 (06/05/08 10:18:58)
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greg schroeder wrote: Wow Greg in dutch! Got plans to come here? 
OC |
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greg schroeder |
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Posts: 4581 (06/05/08 13:34:51)
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Greg, No doubt you have things dialed in pretty good it sounds. I'm not sure what part of Maryland you're in, but Baltimore's dew point
temperature is 65F right now at 5:30PM. If you're spraying in those conditions with evaporation that's pretty high dew point temperature probably in
the 70Fs in the enclosures. With your night drop your set up is about the same as a lower elevation in Irian Jaya.
WWJD
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