Natural hybrids?

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (John Romano) — Mon, 14 Apr 2008 08:21:20 GMT

LD,
Maybe if you paid attention to what I said you would be able to hang in our intellectual evolution conversations instead of adding nonsensical anecdotes. Now don't you have some work to do? I know you have some projects to finish...
j

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (john E blue) — Mon, 14 Apr 2008 08:16:39 GMT

John Romano wrote:
Rainbows and Unicorns 4eva,
j

Indeed.

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (John Romano) — Mon, 14 Apr 2008 08:08:55 GMT

It annoys me when Arnold doesn't cite the information I give him.

"You can get a cornsnake and a king to happily breed too, but they don't do it in the wild..."

Meg, generally ophiophagus snakes don't play well with others, that is not a good example.
j

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (Blue Ridge Biological) — Mon, 14 Apr 2008 07:28:25 GMT

John Romano wrote:
Will,
I figured you would see I was agreeing with your statements on hybrids. However JB claims it did not come out that way.
j

No probs. I saw your point (but also enjoying the discussion between you two). This blurb from Arnold's book fits nicely with some of what you posted:

Given the fact that our environment will continue to...

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (John Romano) — Mon, 14 Apr 2008 04:36:11 GMT
Will,
J.B. called me last night and in between his rants about the inner working of a specific gasket system he is trying to employee in his clusterf*ck of a bathroom project he asked me why I was attacking you here.

I figured you would see I was agreeing with your statements on hybrids. However JB claims it did not come out that way.

Rainbows and Unicorns 4eva,
j

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (john E blue) — Sun, 13 Apr 2008 19:21:17 GMT
Um, I distinctly remember people telling me they were listening with their eyes closed........also, my MOM came up with that uninspired name for the raccoon that perched on my shoulders on BMX rides in the 70s so be careful there CR. Very careful.

Just sayin........

--jb

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (John Romano) — Sun, 13 Apr 2008 18:59:49 GMT
Will,
Remember that time when we were all out at dinner at Hunan? The restaurant was closing, some of us were standing up to go, some people were asleep in their chair and Holland kept rambling on about his childhood pet raccoon named Bandit? Yeah, imagine 14 hours in a car with that.
j

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (john E blue) — Sun, 13 Apr 2008 18:21:50 GMT

John Romano wrote:
Do we have the right answer to the wrong question?

I cannot for the life of me figure out why every person from an environmentalist ......

So if two species can breed in captivity and their.....

I cannot for the life of me figure out how people can begin to assume the right and wrong........

Hey Will, you have just left GA and now...

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (Blue Ridge Biological) — Sun, 13 Apr 2008 16:26:52 GMT

Only Chondro wrote:
Shouldend be any difficult to answer in my oppinion.
Any one find one in the wild?
OC

A vaild question, but a bit naive considering what science continues to reveal regarding interspecific hybridization.

From Dr. Michael Arnold:
"Intregression (hybridization) continues to be identified for an increasing number of plant an...

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (Only Chondro) — Sun, 13 Apr 2008 12:10:09 GMT
Shouldend be any difficult to answer in my oppinion.
Any one find one in the wild?
OC

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (John Romano) — Sat, 12 Apr 2008 21:55:38 GMT
Do we have the right answer to the wrong question? We are asking if different species of a genus can hybridize in the wild if they come into contact with each other (which we have shown they can in captivity).

If you are talking about behavioral reproductive isolation as a means of a barrier won't these behaviors in time change through environmental pressures as the environment changes? For instance, deforestation puts grassland species in contact with forest species,...

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (Blue Ridge Biological) — Fri, 11 Apr 2008 19:27:40 GMT

cnewsom wrote:
Has anyone thought that prezygotic isolation/barriers [read: pressures] (obviously reproductive organ incompatability is out the window via capture hybridization knowledge) might be stronger in the wild, ignoring our obsession of placing 2+ captive, horomone raging ________ (fill in the 'captive animal(s)' here) together, than that of the captive environment; and thus greatly reducing the lightning-strike...

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (cnewsom) — Fri, 11 Apr 2008 16:23:12 GMT
Has anyone thought that prezygotic isolation/barriers [read: pressures] (obviously reproductive organ incompatability is out the window via capture hybridization knowledge) might be stronger in the wild, ignoring our obsession of placing 2+ captive, horomone raging ________ (fill in the 'captive animal(s)' here) together, than that of the captive environment; and thus greatly reducing the lightning-strike lottery odds of certain species producing a 'natural' hybrid?

...

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (Ben Team) — Fri, 11 Apr 2008 09:59:56 GMT

Blue Ridge Biological wrote:

Interesting observations on morphology Marc. Someone (on an anti-hybrid post I read somewhere) said that even though these species are sympatric on range maps, they live in different habitats so they never have opportunities to come into contact with one another. I had seen no good evidence of this in peer-reviewed literature, which is why I wanted to get Rob Heinsohn's opinion regarding his...

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (Blue Ridge Biological) — Fri, 11 Apr 2008 05:41:59 GMT

Interesting observations on morphology Marc. Someone (on an anti-hybrid post I read somewhere) said that even though these species are sympatric on range maps, they live in different habitats so they never have opportunities to come into contact with one another. I had seen no good evidence of this in peer-reviewed literature, which is why I wanted to get Rob Heinsohn's opinion regarding his field observations in Australia. It's good to note your observations in NG as well.
...

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (spataro87) — Fri, 11 Apr 2008 01:49:16 GMT
Will.

The range of both species in New Guinea crosses as well. So they would also have a chance for contact here as well. New guinea Carpets seem more chondro like in their behaviors and body shape and size. I am sure environmental pressures have helped to influenced this, with the dense vegetation and the need to climb for sun light.

Marc

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (Marcial) — Thu, 10 Apr 2008 19:02:35 GMT
hmm... very interesting discussion. is this some sort of natural hybrid?

http://gizmodo.com/368651/new-video-of-bigdog-quadruped-robot-is-so-stunning-its-spooky

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (Blue Ridge Biological) — Thu, 10 Apr 2008 18:52:43 GMT

MegF42 wrote:
Just because they live in the same area, doesn't mean they would interbreed. You can get a cornsnake and a king to happily breed too, but they don't do it in the wild. So far, I've yet to see any carpondros paired together produce any viable offspring....I've seen plenty of carpondro/chondro, or carpet/chondro pairings though. Has anyone produced viable offspring...

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (spataro87) — Thu, 10 Apr 2008 18:43:01 GMT
Meg,

Not that I am aware of but I believe it will happen. If a carpondro can be crossed back to a GTP or carpet to produce viable offspring, chances are sooner or later the right pairing will prove successful.

Marc

Re: Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (MegF42) — Thu, 10 Apr 2008 17:53:08 GMT
Just because they live in the same area, doesn't mean they would interbreed. You can get a cornsnake and a king to happily breed too, but they don't do it in the wild. So far, I've yet to see any carpondros paired together produce any viable offspring....I've seen plenty of carpondro/chondro, or carpet/chondro pairings though. Has anyone produced viable offspring from carpondro/carpondro?

Natural hybrids?

feeds@yuku.com (Blue Ridge Biological) — Wed, 09 Apr 2008 07:39:30 GMT

I recently spoke with Rob Heinsohn, a biologist in Australia who coauthored some papers on M. viridis ecology with David Wilson. He told me that he encounters M. viridis and M. spilota cheynei within the same patches of rainforest in their main study area at Iron Range on Cape York Peninsula.

Knowing this (and witnessing how eagerly and readily these two species copulate in captivity), leads me to wonder if natural hybridization between these two...